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Post by TecBerry on Jun 2, 2021 2:21:23 GMT
I'm new to this group. I recently purchased a new to me 2012 P2008is and have really enjoyed getting flying it and learning all of it's characteristics. I have lots of questions for other P2008 owners and pilots, but my main concern is at what speed should I start rotation? My POH says 48 knots, but mine will not even consider flying at that speed and that's with just me in the plane. I only weigh 170 lbs. I now rotate at 60+ knots and even then, I have to keep the nose down until I pick up airspeed. My rpm at take off is 5200 to 5300 and flaps are in the take off position. I'm wondering if my airspeed indicator is correct or is my POH incorrect or am I doing something wrong. What speeds are other owners and pilots leaving the ground? Thanks in advance.
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Post by Flocker on Jun 2, 2021 17:34:36 GMT
Congrats and welcome to the 912iS owners group. There's only a handful of us on here. I typically get the nose off the ground as soon as possible and let the plane rotate when she's ready. It's usually in the mid-50s if she's light. It could be 60 when heavy. Feel free to hit me up if you have any 912iS questions. I'm a iRMT with 1,000 hrs on my engine.
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Post by TecBerry on Jun 2, 2021 20:22:40 GMT
Thanks for the reply. I flew it again this morning and did 3 TO and Landings and all take offs were pretty bad. Even at 60 plus. I tried a little less flap and a little more than the take off notch and it didn't help. I rotated when I reached 60+ and it came up and then just came back down. I will try your method.
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Mike B
Junior Member
Posts: 52
Home Airport: Summer 2P2 Winter KSRQ
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Post by Mike B on Jun 2, 2021 22:55:07 GMT
Ditto's on the Congrats....
What are you using for a T/O trim setting? Could be you have a bit too much nose down. You might experiment with more nose up trim.
mb
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Post by LSA Flyer on Jun 2, 2021 23:18:51 GMT
I'd bet your prop is pitched for cruise and you need to re-pitch it. With the 912is I'd start with pin #3 and then only move up when you are comfortable with the take off and rate of climb. If that doesn't solve the issue, your engine isn't making rated power for some reason. The 912is gives up 10 Kts to the 914 and trying to match cruise speed with aggressive pitch settings makes for very poor, even scary, take offs. You can cross check your airspeed with the GPS ground speed (adjusted for wind). Is your field unusually hot or high?
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Post by TecBerry on Jun 3, 2021 20:21:02 GMT
Thanks for all of the good suggestions. I set the nose trim a little above center and will try it a bit higher. I'm not sure what number the prop is set, but it doesn't cruise very fast, so I assumed it is set for climb. I will set it to 3 if it's not already. I'm located in Southwest Virginia at KMKJ, so it's not very hot or high. Thanks again.
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Post by Glenn on Jun 3, 2021 20:41:19 GMT
Thanks for all of the good suggestions. I set the nose trim a little above center and will try it a bit higher. I'm not sure what number the prop is set, but it doesn't cruise very fast, so I assumed it is set for climb. I will set it to 3 if it's not already. I'm located in Southwest Virginia at KMKJ, so it's not very hot or high. Thanks again. Define "doesn't cruise very fast." What is your TAS, altitude and RPM? |
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Post by Flocker on Jun 3, 2021 20:47:30 GMT
I flew this morning. Got the nose off the ground early. She rotated at 55. I was solo with full tanks.
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Post by Glenn on Jun 3, 2021 23:20:10 GMT
I flew this morning. Got the nose off the ground early. She rotated at 55. I was solo with full tanks. Wanna do a fun takeoff? Do a text book soft field takeoff. At full gross weight it gets off the ground way before 55...but stay in ground effect until 55. |
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ergo1
Junior Member
Posts: 51
Home Airport: KDXR
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Post by ergo1 on Jun 4, 2021 22:20:48 GMT
I flew this morning. Got the nose off the ground early. She rotated at 55. I was solo with full tanks. Wanna do a fun takeoff? Do a text book soft field takeoff. At full gross weight it gets off the ground way before 55...but stay in ground effect until 55. |
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ergo1
Junior Member
Posts: 51
Home Airport: KDXR
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Post by ergo1 on Jun 4, 2021 22:26:38 GMT
Hi Glenn
I am a new tecnam p2008 turbo owner. Are you concerned about air flow over the engine on a steep climbout to maybe 5000 feet agl? Are you concerned about engine/oil temps?
Thanks
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Post by TecBerry on Jun 4, 2021 23:16:56 GMT
Glenn,
The one time that I did pay attention to the cruise speed, at 5100 rpms it settled in at around 98 to 100 knots. There was some turbulence so I didn't stay at that speed very long. I usually cruise at around 4500 rpm. If I'm not going anywhere in particular, why go fast. My Dynon Skyview warns me that I'm not burning enough gals per hour! (2.5 to 3 gal) I thought that was a good thing.
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Post by Glenn on Jun 4, 2021 23:28:42 GMT
Ergo1,
Your question sounds like my post about doing a soft field takeoff confused you? A soft field take off is not a normal take off. A normal climb is at Vy, not 55.
I apologize if I confused you or if you're not familiar with soft field take off procedures. Are you a pilot in the USA? In the U.S. at the discretion of the Examiner performing a Soft Field Take off and Landing can be required for every Practical Test (the Check Ride). I usually want to see it when I administer a Flight Review.
Depending on the OAT, an extended climb at 55 will probably cause the engine in a P2008 to run at a higher temperature than normal. I suggest climbing at Vx if you have an obstacle in the flight path (until clear of the obstacle) and otherwise climb at Vy. If you do this and your P2008 is overheating, you need to have it looked at.
Cheers.
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ergo1
Junior Member
Posts: 51
Home Airport: KDXR
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Post by ergo1 on Jun 5, 2021 12:59:34 GMT
Hi Glenn,
I have my private pilot license with an instrument rating but I’m a little rusty in my flying skills.
In answer to your question, I thought that you were suggesting a steep climb after rotation. My confusion and mistake.
Stay Safe and Be Well
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Post by LSA Flyer on Jun 5, 2021 19:23:11 GMT
Assuming you are comfortable with the Lycoming and Continental engines, it takes a bit of faith to relax with a Rorax buzzing along at 5 to 5500 RPM. But the engine is happiest at that 5 to 5400 range and is least stressed there. Your takeoff setting should be full power, every time, and hold it at full power until you reach a safe altitude or your intended cruse altitude. This usually comes out to a 70Kt airspeed with the 912is, accepting whatever rate of climb this gives you. The RPM should be about 5200 at that climb airspeed and the rate will vary depending on weight and density altitude. 4500 RPM is a bit low for long cruise periods. especially with 100LL. The engine will run happier near 5000 and clear the lead better. The 914 engine will require more throttle management on takeoff/climb; the 912 just wants you to floor it and manage your RPM/Airspeed with angle of climb.
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